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Post by Immortal_Dragon on May 4, 2016 4:05:43 GMT
So, this is an old idea that I had back on the old forum. There it was part of the Miscellaneous Questions and Bugs thread. I tried to go back and find it but it seems to have disappeared. Oh well, I was recommended to try putting it here so I'll try and reconstruct the gist of it from memory.
(Please note, this is an idea/concept that would more than likely be done quite far down the line, after life of all kinds on more "conventional" planets are solidified and done.)
*clears throat*
Essentially, what we begin with is a gas giant, it's obviously got no surface to speak of, but different layers of gas. These gasses obviously have other particulates within them, some of them might just be organic.
What would start a journey of evolution on a gas giant would be either a sudden influx of new organic compounds (perhaps a chunk of a planet that used to have life on it?)striking the planet, or simple spontaneous changes, that prompts the existing organic compounds to start to bond together to make microbes that can float on certain compositions of gas. Enter the player.
A new game would start with a basic microbe, except you're floating amongst a layer of gas that can support you, and you will see other bits and bobs of other compounds that you can digest. As you get bigger though you sink further and further down into heavier gas layers. What is a solution to this?
Vacuoles filled with particles of lighter gasses of course. These allow you to float within a certain gas layer in the same way a hot air balloon or zeppelin uses warmer air/lighter gasses to ascend. These vacuoles could also be emptied for a burst of speed at the cost of maintaining altitude.
As microbes start to bond together, they start creating small net-like networks that share resources gathered amongst the gas, whether they be compounds to digest, or gas gathered in vacuoles. Eventually these start to become specialized, forming the first complex organisms.
An evolving ecosystem within a gas giant would likely become determined by what layer within the gas giant the organisms reside. Higher gas layers might actually become dominated by autotrophs who can get some access to the solar system's sun by climbing higher and higher amongst the layers of gas and photosynthesizing.
"Mid" layers of gas would likely be dominated by filter feeders, which could be stationary or mobile in a sort of active or passive role. Passive filter feeders would simply float along the currents of gas, using their evolved air sacs to stay at least somewhat level within their current area, and use the flows of gasses to float along. Active filter feeders however might move about and around different gas layers by using propulsion from modified air sacs that push out streams of gas, or on wings. The more active filter feeders (and other organisms that use this active method of travel) may be able to see their environment either by sense of smell (they can detect other organisms that are "up flow" of them), thermal sensing (detect another organism as it is likely warmer than the surrounding gas), or even sonar (the gas is a medium for sound to travel in).
It is in these layers that you'd also find predatory species, that likely feed on these filter feeders and use similar methods of propulsion to their prey.
Now, it is at lower levels of gas that it could get interesting. It's no doubt very dark here, but the heavy blankets of gas would also make it extremely warm. The pressures would also become immense no doubt. So, any organisms that develop here could likely be thermovores (or whatever the term would be when absorbing energy from heat sources). Granted, this could be supplemented with filter feeding, but it might also be viable at very low high density levels of gas.
Granted, this would be extremely unlikely (maybe impossible) to gain true sapience with, since there's nothing to really establish a civilization around. But there's nothing stopping social behaviors from forming amongst the clouds.
So, what's the consensus, does this sound like something that could be done down the road? Or does this just not seem fun without some tweaking?
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Post by Nornjen on May 4, 2016 8:47:38 GMT
I like the possibility of life on gas giants. It always bothered me that there is no interaction with gas giants within spore whatsoever. Even if you have the most sophisticated space ship, which can fly through wormholes. You cant go on gas giants... I was really sad when i read tjwhales dev-thread about planet generation. He said there he would limit the maximum size of starter-planets to the size where they begin to hold lighter gases like hydrogen and become gas giants. Due to the high pressure and no light within the gaslayers, if i remember it properly. This shouldnt be a problem since there are creatures on the bottom of Miriana Trench, which live also under very high pressure. & and the rest what is written above???
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Post by Immortal_Dragon on May 4, 2016 14:15:03 GMT
I like the possibility of life on gas giants. It always bothered me that there is no interaction with gas giants within spore whatsoever. Even if you have the most sophisticated space ship, which can fly through wormholes. You cant go on gas giants... I was really sad when i read tjwhales dev-thread about planet generation. He said there he would limit the maximum size of starter-planets to the size where they begin to hold lighter gases like hydrogen and become gas giants. Due to the high pressure and no light within the gaslayers, if i remember it properly. This shouldnt be a problem since there are creatures on the bottom of Miriana Trench, which live also under very high pressure. & and the rest what is written above???
Oh, I didn't see that dev-thread. Still, this is an old idea of mine for a kind of radically different ecosystem, so I thought, "Why not a gas giant?" It's got no surface to speak of, but it is entirely possible that small enough microbial life could float on the currents. And since light wouldn't really get down into the lower levels of gas there'd be nothing like traditional plants, so what would take their place? Filter feeders that sift through the gasses for their food. Now, I did forget the possibility that a "predatory" species that manages to get into and stay in the higher gas levels with what autotrophs develop could start to feed on them instead of the filter feeders below, or make a hybrid diet of them both.
But it also affects how combat between organisms would work, as agents such as venoms and toxins wouldn't really work since an errant gas current could just blow it away in the case of sprayed agents, and all that would really be needed to bring prey down would be to rupture an air sac. Other organisms could evolve armored air sacs of course, but again there could be ways around that. So, while venomous organisms may develop, I don't think they'd be the norm unless there was mass evolution of armored air sacs to prevent rupture.
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Post by tjwhale on May 4, 2016 15:07:28 GMT
I was really sad when i read tjwhales dev-thread about planet generation. He said there he would limit the maximum size of starter-planets to the size where they begin to hold lighter gases like hydrogen and become gas giants. Due to the high pressure and no light within the gaslayers, if i remember it properly. This shouldnt be a problem since there are creatures on the bottom of Miriana Trench, which live also under very high pressure. & and the rest what is written above??? The issue with super size planets is not so much the microbe stage. As you say you can live by a thermal vent etc. It's even ok to have your planet frozen over so long as you have plenty of Hydrogen Sulfide bubbling up you can live there quite happily. However I was thinking more about which planets were eligible for the whole game. In order to go through the cities / industrial / space stage there are some relatively narrow requirements. I think the idea of life on gas giants is really cool. Here is a video of Carl Sagan talking about it. However if you started on a gas giant you couldn't really make a city or develop advanced technology etc. I guess maybe you could have some kind of floating world? But it's very difficult to imagine and very science fiction. It would also require a lot of programming. So that was why I picked that as an upper limit. It is quite arbitrary and I'd very happily go and change it if we had a good plan for what would happen on life on a larger planet. However I think, in general, the game should start you on a planet where there is at least a hope you could play the whole game. Playing for a while and finding your planet had a 0% chance of letting you make it through the game would be quite frustrating. If it had a 0.1% chance that could be really thrilling as a hardcore mode, trying to make a civilisation work somewhere which is super hostile.
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Post by Immortal_Dragon on May 4, 2016 15:27:44 GMT
The issue with super size planets is not so much the microbe stage. As you say you can live by a thermal vent etc. It's even ok to have your planet frozen over so long as you have plenty of Hydrogen Sulfide bubbling up you can live there quite happily. However I was thinking more about which planets were eligible for the whole game. In order to go through the cities / industrial / space stage there are some relatively narrow requirements. I think the idea of life on gas giants is really cool. Here is a video of Carl Sagan talking about it. However if you started on a gas giant you couldn't really make a city or develop advanced technology etc. I guess maybe you could have some kind of floating world? But it's very difficult to imagine and very science fiction. It would also require a lot of programming. So that was why I picked that as an upper limit. It is quite arbitrary and I'd very happily go and change it if we had a good plan for what would happen on life on a larger planet. However I think, in general, the game should start you on a planet where there is at least a hope you could play the whole game. Playing for a while and finding your planet had a 0% chance of letting you make it through the game would be quite frustrating. If it had a 0.1% chance that could be really thrilling as a hardcore mode, trying to make a civilisation work somewhere which is super hostile.
That makes a lot of sense.
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Post by Nornjen on May 4, 2016 16:09:32 GMT
tjwhale usually does.^^ Really enjoyed reading the theoretics dev-threads! Thx=) Understood. Tough the gameplay on unusual environments would be very interesting and quite challanging for the human mind. I mean you would always have to be aware what is above and beneath you - could be predators there.^^ As for materials which are required to bring up your civilization. There would be some in the planets core, but pretty unreachable for stone age civilizations i suppose.
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Post by Atrox on May 4, 2016 18:13:04 GMT
Like underwater civilizations, floaty species might need to be uplifted. I'm all for gas giant organisms tjwhale I agree that by default a player should get a rocky planet to live on, but if they want, perhaps they could be given the option of living on a gas giant? They could even get a notification telling them that it would be nigh impossible to advance past the aware stage.
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Post by Immortal_Dragon on May 4, 2016 19:02:51 GMT
Like underwater civilizations, floaty species might need to be uplifted. I'm all for gas giant organisms tjwhale I agree that by default a player should get a rocky planet to live on, but if they want, perhaps they could be given the option of living on a gas giant? They could even get a notification telling them that it would be nigh impossible to advance past the aware stage. That would be a good way to hash it out. It could entirely be possible to develop extremely large organisms in such an environment since there's nothing to hold a body or weight on, maybe large enough that some smaller organisms could make a living off of settling on its back? Essentially, they could support themselves on the larger organism's back, and could fill cleaner niches, or actually live on its back as an environment. An example could be organisms that scuttle along the back of the big organism, and may use organic nets that are hung up to catch food like filter feeders do. These could even be somewhat of parasites themselves, as they could feed off of the large organism.
Sorry about the tangent, just sharing an idea for how a more conventional society might develop, even if it might not get past bone/stone age technology like an underwater one.
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Post by Atrox on May 4, 2016 20:01:43 GMT
I believe there was a plan to be able to make organisms large enough to act as their own biome of sorts, so I can definitely see that happening! A tribe of intelligent giant parasites that's really interesting
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Post by Immortal_Dragon on May 4, 2016 20:17:52 GMT
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infectant
Multicellular
Spreading throughout your body...
Posts: 44
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Post by infectant on May 4, 2016 20:40:46 GMT
What about NPC life on gas giants in the Space Stage?
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Post by Atrox on May 4, 2016 20:43:55 GMT
What do you mean?
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Post by mitobox on May 5, 2016 1:20:37 GMT
I guess he means native plant and animal life, as would be with normal planets. Probably would be generated the same way, too, just a bit differently. So even if playing on a gas giant isn't an option, life could still potentially show up.
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Post by GRODOG on Sept 1, 2016 23:10:45 GMT
If u wanna play as a creature in a gas giant? This is pretty easy... complete the game first and go to ascencion gate... then find (if lucky) or if u get to frustrated looking create or develop life in a gas giant and then play as the creatures in it or even reincarnate into them (i hward u can reincarnate and start the game over so why not do it on a gas giant as an ultra hardcore? Or a nice game of see how log you survive before extinction!!!! This would be fun like coming together wih your friends to see how long you survive as a species in a gas giant!! Kinda like in gta 3 where pwople would see how long would they survive with all weapons or the tank cheat!!
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Post by GRODOG on Sept 1, 2016 23:25:10 GMT
Here are suggestions on the perfect gas giant paradise!!
Islands? Make a floating coral or a floating fungus or take Subnautica's reefback and make it able to grow trees on its back!!
Herbivores? Make thingies that eat floaty plant thingies
Carnivores? Scavenger: adapts to the core and flies down there to wat the corpses of creatures... Predator: it hunts like a boss
Omnivores? Combine both...
Plants? Floaty plant thingies...
Fungus? Read the first part
Quasars? Primum specieum cant fly why would you ask this?!
Land dwellers? COLLOSAL WALKERS THAT ADAPT TO THE CORE!!
Sentient Lyfe? It will take eons but this is the process... firat tribal things would be made of floaty plant wood and bones... then metal? Either adapting to core to gather carbon from corpses and metals that COULD be found there... or just get uplifted by the Uteens... Society? Getting out of the hous and talking to eachother... then de-evolving back to staying home with social medias!! Yaay!!!! Space? hardest part but u will need very strong ships and thrusters to survive the pressure and escape the storms safely!! Same goes for all other vehicles but when u get vehicles capable of working there everything gets easy!! Also u could domesticate giant whales and ride them!! HYPE!!
And thats all i know for now...
Oh i almost forgot...
Water? Smoke that vapor...
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Post by ThreeCubed on Sept 2, 2016 15:55:31 GMT
When you think about it, GasGiants are just gigantic Miller Uler Expiramenets, electricity in the top, war vapor rises up, and life molecules can form. Maybe life on gas giants should be more common. As in still very rare but we can find them. As for playing as a gas giant creature, it would be a bit hard to figure out the different mechanics but I guess the easy was is to just girl low them to use more watery parts such as air sacks or wings that allow them to survive in the gas giant atmosphere while also being effiecnt enough to generate energy off of what they eat/photo synthesize, just my thoughts
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Post by GRODOG on Sept 12, 2016 3:37:17 GMT
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Post by Immortal_Dragon on Sept 12, 2016 4:30:44 GMT
I saw that trailer some time ago, and no I don't think it would be too out of place in what I had in mind, though I was initially more inspired by the documentary hosted by Stephen Hawking, Into the Universe, and its section on gas giant life in terms of appearances.
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